Supreme Court Justice Amy Coney Barrett triggered fierce backlash from MAGA loyalists after forcefully questioning the Trump administration’s top lawyer and voicing skepticism over ending birthright citizenship during a heated Supreme Court argument.

Since taking office, Donald Trump has pushed for an executive order to end birthright citizenship, a constitutional guarantee under the 14th Amendment that grants automatic U.S. citizenship to anyone born on American soil.

During oral arguments, Barrett confronted Solicitor General Dean John Sauer, who was representing the Trump administration, over his dismissive response to Justice Elena Kagan’s concerns. Barrett sharply asked whether Sauer truly believed there was “no way” for plaintiffs to quickly challenge the executive order, suggesting that class-action certification might expedite the process.

  • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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    10 hours ago

    The Fifth Amendment.

    “No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury…”

    • ubergeek@lemmy.today
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      3 hours ago

      The fifth amendment doesn’t apply to impeachment, nor does it in the event of ballot qualifications. Like, the 5th amendment doesn’t apply to age restrictions on holding public office.

      The law says,“If you engaged in insurrection, you are ineligible to hold federal office”. Just like is says,“If you are under 35, you are ineligible to hold the office of President”.

      • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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        3 hours ago

        Correct. How do we determine that someone was involved in an insurrection? You can’t hold him accountable to the crime without conviction or adjudication. Otherwise it’s merely an accusation, and anyone could just say a person was part of an insurrection to bar them from holding office.

        • ubergeek@lemmy.today
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          3 hours ago

          You watch them on TV doing it. And after you see them on TV doing it, they become unqualified for office, based on the due process afforded by the state attorney generals, and/or departments that manage who is and who isn’t qualified and can be placed on a ballot, per due process.

          You don’t need a court to adjudicate being of improper age, do you? Certain items can be considered “prima facie”… Basically: You, and everyone else watched it happens is considered prima facie for processes like this.

          • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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            3 hours ago

            We didn’t see Trump break into the White House. Unless it’s proven that he was a part of it, he’s not part of it. Innocent until proven guilty.

            You need legal documentation to prove your age, yes. It must be issued by a state of federal governing body. You can’t just have your friend vouch for you.

            • ubergeek@lemmy.today
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              3 hours ago

              We didn’t see Trump break into the White House.

              We saw him tell his people to go do it, and the refuse to tell them to stop it.

              That’s called “leading an insurrection”.

              • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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                2 hours ago

                That could be argued as a poor decision or incompetence. You’d need to prove it in court otherwise it’s hearsay. It’s not like there’s photographic proof of him breaking into the White House.

                • ubergeek@lemmy.today
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                  40 minutes ago

                  He was literally telling them live on TV to go storm the Capitol.

                  That is called “prima facie”: facts that speak for themselves.

                  And it is fully valid to use as a test in a process already codified in law: secretary of state (or similar postition) decides ballot eligibility.

    • ExtantHuman@lemm.ee
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      7 hours ago

      There’s a difference between being thrown in jail without a trial and… Being barred from the highest office of the country - a position of public service.

      You have a right to freedom, not to a specific job

      • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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        7 hours ago

        Without conviction, what is to stop anyone from simply accusing a President of participating in an insurrection and immediately having them removed from office?

        • ExtantHuman@lemm.ee
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          5 hours ago

          Firstly, there’s a difference from being barred from the election proces, and already being in office and removed from it…

          • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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            3 hours ago

            So you think that someone can say “he was a part of an insurrection” the night before an election and allow the contender to automatically win?

            You’re arguing semantics and completely missing the point. Conviction or adjudication is how we prove things happened. It’s how the law works.

    • Nougat@fedia.io
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      10 hours ago

      Disqualification from holding office is not punishment for a crime. If it were, everyone under age 35 would have a 5th Amendment argument to make.

      Try again.

      • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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        10 hours ago

        Held to answer does not mean sentenced. It means held responsible, or convicted. Accusations or charges are insufficient for accountability according to the Constitution.

        Otherwise, you could just accuse every President you don’t like of an insurrection and they’d immediately be removed from office.

        • Nougat@fedia.io
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          10 hours ago

          “Held to answer” in this context, with the reference to a grand jury, is talking about criminal charges, convictions, and punishment.

          Or are you suggesting that a 34 year old would have to come before a grand jury before being disqualified from the office of President?

          • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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            10 hours ago

            Are you suggesting there’s logic to your argument? You can’t just say, “he was part of an insurrection” and disqualify him from office. It needs to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt in a court of law and he must be found guilty by a jury of his peers. Otherwise, anyone could accuse a sitting President of an insurrection and they’d be removed from office. Think about it.

            • Nougat@fedia.io
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              10 hours ago

              Guess what happened? Colorado Supreme Court found that he had participated, making him ineligible to appear on the Colorado ballot. This is appropriate, because states manage elections, that’s also written in the Constitution.

              Then SCOTUS stepped in and swept that aside, is direct contradiction to the Constitution.

              Their excuse was that a “patchwork” of states shouldn’t have this power. Even though they quite literally do.

              So whatever squabble we’re having here is moot.

              • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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                10 hours ago

                Read the link I provided. It was not considered an insurrection according to the DOJ or SCOTUS, because he was trying to remain in power rather than overthrow the existing power of the government.

                  • disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world
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                    7 hours ago

                    I didn’t say it was. I’m saying that’s why Jack Smith did not charge him with inciting an insurrection. It was not an insurrection by definition if he was a part of it. If he was not a part of it, it could be considered one. It’s legally murky.