I cancelled my framework 16 order because of their “big tent” policy meaning they give funding to Hyperland and Omarchy, I will not give my money to people who fund racists
DHH is pretty fucking racist, white replacement theory is right up there with the worst of racist beliefs
I thought I might move there one day. That was then. Now, I wouldn’t dream of it. London is no longer the city I was infatuated with in the late '90s and early 2000s. Chiefly because it’s no longer full of native Brits. In 2000, more than sixty percent of the city were native Brits. By 2024, that had dropped to about a third.
I am not expecting my single cancellation to make the slightest difference to their policy, they already made it clear that they are quite happy funding racists when multiple people have challenged them over it, and with one of their larger pots of cash they give out as well.
What I am getting out of is knowing I am not (indirectly) funding racists myself, rather than knowingly funding racists. I do not see it any different from buying products from Musk, if you did it ages ago then fine, but after, thats something else entirely.
I wouldn’t buy a Dell because I wouldn’t trust the hardware, his position is just the icing. Whole reason I wanted the framework was because I wanted something to last a very long time, I simply do not trust Dell to provide support or parts long term.
The Tim Apple situation hurt, as I really liked the apple silicon for build quality and I had an old Intel Macbook that did indeed last a very long time (still boots even now). However their RAM/Storage pricing for what is an essential amount of storage for me mean even without Timmys boot licking making them a non starter.
I wont buy Nvidia because of their shitty Linux support, Huang being an absolute womble
Lenovo is about as good as you getting for a mainstream brand, and they are ultimately owned by the CCP so meh.
I think with Framework it particularly hurts as at least with Dell or Apple they are quite openly rimming Trump because it will give them competitive advantage and tax cuts while they never really pretended to be for the public good.
WTF do Framework get by supporting Hyperland or Omarchy? Its literary supporting your racist uncle who makes moonshine for half a dozen people when you set yourself up to be an ethical alternative whose current market is more likely to be ethical seeking. Imagine if Oxfam or Doctors without Borders started supporting Trump? World of difference from the NRA supporting Trump due to the starting position.
Lenovo is about as good as you getting for a mainstream brand, and they are ultimately owned by the CCP so meh.
In addition to being owned by the CCP, they purposely installed rootkits on consumer hardware for intense data gathering, and it ended up getting compromised.
I dont use factory installed images from anybody, mostly because of this shit. I also dont use windows, not that I would trust a factory installed Linux either
Yeah, the whole situation sucks. I totally agree and wish that framework would reconsider their position on the matter.
The country is basically unrecognizable at this point IMO. The capitulation that has occurred so quickly in the second Trump term was stunning to behold. For a vast array of industries (computers being one of them), every reasonably ethical option feels like it flew out the window.
I plan on going for a used Lenovo, something with as many generic, replaceable components as possible with as little soldered to the motherboard as I can get away with. I trust the workplace models to be more reliable and supportable long term than anybody else.
That way Lenovo do not see a penny of my money and I will only have a very very small upward impact on used prices due to the volumes of used Lenovos sold.
Tim Cook designed and delivered a custom award to Trump.
Which looked like a gold-plated turd, but Trump likely can’t recognize that with his absence of taste. Apple so obviously could make something better-looking that I’ve had a solid chuckle seeing that shit, and my opinion of Apple hadn’t moved. In exchange for that piece of crap they’ve gotten Trump to lay his mitts off tariffs on what Apple needed, so sounds like a job well done to me. It’s not Apple’s business to topple an idiot that stupid USian public elected.
Thank you for your position. While I appreciate the framework idea, and stated mission — in reality I don’t trust them, so I don’t mix the mission with them, the mission is valuable, them, I wouldn’t be so sure — I feel the same. I don’t want to support them now. It’s a complicated situation we’re in, regarding the state of the tech, but I don’t like this ‘we have to help them, just because we can unscrew their backpanel easily.’ The modules isn’t something I’m impressed with, I think that’s overthinking. I’d rather have a tiny laptop with nothing and a huge laptop with everything. Looks like Apple got this.
The apple silicon looks amazing, it would be my choice if I didn’t really dislike Tim Apple, and Apples excessive price gouging with storage and RAM pushing what would be a usable model for my requirements up significantly.
Equipping the base laptop with 256Gb of storage in the current year then charging how much to jump to even 512Gb, which is still pretty small amount, is a piss take.
They are are bad for RAM upgrade pricing, at least the base model has 16Gb. With both storage and RAM being soldered on, you are stuck either using external drives or cloud storage.
Second hand would be my pick, that way Apple do not see a penny of the money.
I had a order with them that they chose to cancel because they just randomly charged the account one day months after I had pre-ordered something, and there wasn’t enough money in the account because I didn’t know when they were going to charge for it. They didn’t contact me or anything, they just cancelled the order. Thanks guys.
I never ordered a Framework before but I’m planning to do this year. Isn’t that how it’s supposed to be? Last time I visited their site it was written that you pay a reserve price at the time of order, then they charge your card later with the remainig price before they ship it.
Right but who has like three grand just sitting in a checking account, that shit in a savings account because I’m not Bill Gates and I need every penny I can get from the interest? If they’re not going to tell you at the time that you pre-order when they’re going to bill you, then they need to contact you ahead of time or that’s going to keep happening.
I mean, I have that in my account. But I’m also paranoid about bounced checks and don’t see the appeal of getting a nickel a month in exchange for worrying about something suddenly eating my float and causing bounced checks.
The interest rate on the checking account tied to my checking is not great…
Right but who has like three grand just sitting in a checking account, that shit in a savings account because I’m not Bill Gates and I need every penny I can get from the interest?
Literally no one does it like that…no one. You place an order for something that’s backordered, they also don’t charge you until it’s shipped, and you won’t get notified beforehand either.
Notify me would literally be an email they couldn’t even be bothered to do that.
You would have thought they actually wanted the three grand, like contacting me cost cost them nothing and they didn’t do it they just cancelled the order.
I cannot express this part enough, the time between the pre-order and them charging me was like 5 months. I’m not going to keep massive amounts of money in a personal account for months on end just so they can randomly charge for it on a arbitrary Wednesday afternoon that’s ridiculous.
That sucks. I’ve also had mixed experiences with their support arm but the hardware and designs are pretty top notch. It really is nice to buy a laptop that isn’t inevitably headed for the landfill in five years.
Yes, but jokes aside, it seems like you can find whatever you need for MacBooks from circa 2010 to 2012. At least, when I needed something, I could find it without issues.
I prefer my to buy computers from companies that aren’t actively combating repairability efforts for their products and purposefully making them prematurely obsolete.
While I agree, I’d like Apple (and others) to make repairability better (or even exist), but as an owner of quite a lot of Apple tech, it’s very well made, usually. Until it breaks, obviously, but it breaks less than a random cheap brand. At least for me. Any other computer maker is rather unable to lock down the devices the same way. I bet they’d happily do so, if given the opportunity. Plenty of modern laptops with non-swappable memory and even SSDs.
What are you on about? I’ve been running a 9370 for 7 years, only replaced the battery last year and now I’m back at 8 hours. I changed the cooling paste just the other week. Best laptop I’ve ever owned, the only thing I’d want is a larger trackpad. There’s just a small amount of coil whine so I might replace the fans if it gets worse.
Keeping in mind I’ve abused this thing, was in my backback on my two major falls on my eboard. Only bending one of the corners slightly. This thing is a tank and a powerhouse.
Um, I was just sharing my experience with an xps. You have different experience, with a different xps model I’d guess. I’m glad you’re happy with it!
I didn’t even share the worst part of my experience: when it died it just died, refused to turn on. Immediate brick, no warning. This has happened to quite a few people I found, from frantic searching at the time.
I’ve bought dell for 20 years but their quality has been falling for the last decade, in my opinion and based on having bought about a dozen (for various people).
I’ll never buy an xps again. Last one needed pretty much everything replacing, and within 3 years dell stopped manufacturing the battery!!
$2k on a laptop that’s a brick within 3 years?
Framework 13 all the way
I cancelled my framework 16 order because of their “big tent” policy meaning they give funding to Hyperland and Omarchy, I will not give my money to people who fund racists
What’s wrong with Omarchy?
DHH is pretty fucking racist, white replacement theory is right up there with the worst of racist beliefs
https://world.hey.com/dhh/as-i-remember-london-e7d38e64
Eh, I get it, but you can’t win every battle.
I have a 16 and a 13. I bought them both before that thread.
I am not expecting my single cancellation to make the slightest difference to their policy, they already made it clear that they are quite happy funding racists when multiple people have challenged them over it, and with one of their larger pots of cash they give out as well.
What I am getting out of is knowing I am not (indirectly) funding racists myself, rather than knowingly funding racists. I do not see it any different from buying products from Musk, if you did it ages ago then fine, but after, thats something else entirely.
I get it, but also if I stopped buying everything from every racist / racist supporter, I would have no real options for laptops generally speaking.
Michael Dell is a complete and total Trump supporter. Should I buy an XPS?
Tim Cook designed and delivered a custom award to Trump. Knowing this, should I buy an Apple?
I understand wanting to vote with your dollars but in practice there are few or no ethical options for many things that you can buy.
I wouldn’t buy a Dell because I wouldn’t trust the hardware, his position is just the icing. Whole reason I wanted the framework was because I wanted something to last a very long time, I simply do not trust Dell to provide support or parts long term.
The Tim Apple situation hurt, as I really liked the apple silicon for build quality and I had an old Intel Macbook that did indeed last a very long time (still boots even now). However their RAM/Storage pricing for what is an essential amount of storage for me mean even without Timmys boot licking making them a non starter.
I wont buy Nvidia because of their shitty Linux support, Huang being an absolute womble
Lenovo is about as good as you getting for a mainstream brand, and they are ultimately owned by the CCP so meh.
I think with Framework it particularly hurts as at least with Dell or Apple they are quite openly rimming Trump because it will give them competitive advantage and tax cuts while they never really pretended to be for the public good.
WTF do Framework get by supporting Hyperland or Omarchy? Its literary supporting your racist uncle who makes moonshine for half a dozen people when you set yourself up to be an ethical alternative whose current market is more likely to be ethical seeking. Imagine if Oxfam or Doctors without Borders started supporting Trump? World of difference from the NRA supporting Trump due to the starting position.
In addition to being owned by the CCP, they purposely installed rootkits on consumer hardware for intense data gathering, and it ended up getting compromised.
I dont use factory installed images from anybody, mostly because of this shit. I also dont use windows, not that I would trust a factory installed Linux either
Yeah, the whole situation sucks. I totally agree and wish that framework would reconsider their position on the matter.
The country is basically unrecognizable at this point IMO. The capitulation that has occurred so quickly in the second Trump term was stunning to behold. For a vast array of industries (computers being one of them), every reasonably ethical option feels like it flew out the window.
I plan on going for a used Lenovo, something with as many generic, replaceable components as possible with as little soldered to the motherboard as I can get away with. I trust the workplace models to be more reliable and supportable long term than anybody else.
That way Lenovo do not see a penny of my money and I will only have a very very small upward impact on used prices due to the volumes of used Lenovos sold.
Which looked like a gold-plated turd, but Trump likely can’t recognize that with his absence of taste. Apple so obviously could make something better-looking that I’ve had a solid chuckle seeing that shit, and my opinion of Apple hadn’t moved. In exchange for that piece of crap they’ve gotten Trump to lay his mitts off tariffs on what Apple needed, so sounds like a job well done to me. It’s not Apple’s business to topple an idiot that stupid USian public elected.
The turd was just the icing on top of the shit cake dude. They gave that jack off millions of dollars.
Welp, then I guess you’re the type of customer they fully deserve.
How many millions did they give? I know of the one million for the inauguration. Do you think one million is much money for either Apple or Trump?
Thank you for your position. While I appreciate the framework idea, and stated mission — in reality I don’t trust them, so I don’t mix the mission with them, the mission is valuable, them, I wouldn’t be so sure — I feel the same. I don’t want to support them now. It’s a complicated situation we’re in, regarding the state of the tech, but I don’t like this ‘we have to help them, just because we can unscrew their backpanel easily.’ The modules isn’t something I’m impressed with, I think that’s overthinking. I’d rather have a tiny laptop with nothing and a huge laptop with everything. Looks like Apple got this.
I do not trust them either, not after this.
The apple silicon looks amazing, it would be my choice if I didn’t really dislike Tim Apple, and Apples excessive price gouging with storage and RAM pushing what would be a usable model for my requirements up significantly.
Equipping the base laptop with 256Gb of storage in the current year then charging how much to jump to even 512Gb, which is still pretty small amount, is a piss take.
They are are bad for RAM upgrade pricing, at least the base model has 16Gb. With both storage and RAM being soldered on, you are stuck either using external drives or cloud storage.
Second hand would be my pick, that way Apple do not see a penny of the money.
I’m a little miffed with framework actually.
I had a order with them that they chose to cancel because they just randomly charged the account one day months after I had pre-ordered something, and there wasn’t enough money in the account because I didn’t know when they were going to charge for it. They didn’t contact me or anything, they just cancelled the order. Thanks guys.
Edit: Deleted an extra word
I never ordered a Framework before but I’m planning to do this year. Isn’t that how it’s supposed to be? Last time I visited their site it was written that you pay a reserve price at the time of order, then they charge your card later with the remainig price before they ship it.
Right but who has like three grand just sitting in a checking account, that shit in a savings account because I’m not Bill Gates and I need every penny I can get from the interest? If they’re not going to tell you at the time that you pre-order when they’re going to bill you, then they need to contact you ahead of time or that’s going to keep happening.
I mean, I have that in my account. But I’m also paranoid about bounced checks and don’t see the appeal of getting a nickel a month in exchange for worrying about something suddenly eating my float and causing bounced checks.
The interest rate on the checking account tied to my checking is not great…
Since when are there savings accounts with interest rates worth even calculating? The interest rate on my savings account is down at 0.01%.
Dude use a credit card.
Excuse me everybody, I just wanted to intercept and say that if that was written as Bill fucking Gates, that would be so much funnier :)
Literally no one does it like that…no one. You place an order for something that’s backordered, they also don’t charge you until it’s shipped, and you won’t get notified beforehand either.
Notify me would literally be an email they couldn’t even be bothered to do that.
You would have thought they actually wanted the three grand, like contacting me cost cost them nothing and they didn’t do it they just cancelled the order.
I cannot express this part enough, the time between the pre-order and them charging me was like 5 months. I’m not going to keep massive amounts of money in a personal account for months on end just so they can randomly charge for it on a arbitrary Wednesday afternoon that’s ridiculous.
That sucks. I’ve also had mixed experiences with their support arm but the hardware and designs are pretty top notch. It really is nice to buy a laptop that isn’t inevitably headed for the landfill in five years.
Yes, but jokes aside, it seems like you can find whatever you need for MacBooks from circa 2010 to 2012. At least, when I needed something, I could find it without issues.
I prefer my to buy computers from companies that aren’t actively combating repairability efforts for their products and purposefully making them prematurely obsolete.
And those are…
Framework for one, but just about any other computer maker is better by that metric.
While I agree, I’d like Apple (and others) to make repairability better (or even exist), but as an owner of quite a lot of Apple tech, it’s very well made, usually. Until it breaks, obviously, but it breaks less than a random cheap brand. At least for me. Any other computer maker is rather unable to lock down the devices the same way. I bet they’d happily do so, if given the opportunity. Plenty of modern laptops with non-swappable memory and even SSDs.
What are you on about? I’ve been running a 9370 for 7 years, only replaced the battery last year and now I’m back at 8 hours. I changed the cooling paste just the other week. Best laptop I’ve ever owned, the only thing I’d want is a larger trackpad. There’s just a small amount of coil whine so I might replace the fans if it gets worse.
Keeping in mind I’ve abused this thing, was in my backback on my two major falls on my eboard. Only bending one of the corners slightly. This thing is a tank and a powerhouse.
Um, I was just sharing my experience with an xps. You have different experience, with a different xps model I’d guess. I’m glad you’re happy with it!
I didn’t even share the worst part of my experience: when it died it just died, refused to turn on. Immediate brick, no warning. This has happened to quite a few people I found, from frantic searching at the time.
I’ve bought dell for 20 years but their quality has been falling for the last decade, in my opinion and based on having bought about a dozen (for various people).
Yeah I’d be mad as hell too, I’ve heard their customer service is pretty terrible as well. I haven’t really noticed the quality issues though.
Cool story
Enlightening comment, what you want? Proof?